Why do we care if circumcision is a net benefit or a net neutral for health? We don't do it for health reasons, we do it for religious/cultural reasons, and we'd do it anyway.
I feel like this is an advertisement trying to convince me that the car I just bought is a great car. I already bought it!
I agree that studies showing health benefits of other scientific "proofs" of halachic practices may irrelevant to those of us that would keep them anyway. They also have a downside in that if the alleged proof is debunked, those who relied on it to support their acceptance of halacha will be disillusioned. This is my key objection to the "bible codes" shenanigans.
However, in this case there is a significant upside to this study, in that it helps combat the hateful disinformation spread by the anti-circumcision groups, who have actually been campaigning to make it illegal. Anything that debunks those religion-hating kooks is a good thing. Maybe there are even secular Jews who are on the fence on this issue, who will now go decide in favor of circumcision, albeit for a "lo lishma" reason.
Elie: It's a good point that scientific findings like this or on, say, kosher meat, can both convince people to stop following halakhah and bring in people as well. Still, it's good to know, isn't it? Like if there's a benefit that is actually applicable to us, we say cool, and maybe understand something about ourselves more, and if something that might be detrimental, then it is good to know, and might mean we come up with new technologies so as to keep halakhah while mitigating the detriments. Also, I understand there are many folks who are not as extreme anti-routine-circumcision activists, who want to get rid of the pressure placed by the medical establishment to circumcise and want to have it accepted as not abnormal, but who understand and do not fight against the bris. Just as this finding really shouldn't change what we do, should we have an opinion on what others do? Do we anyway?
(juvenile) Did anyone catch the very fitting name of WHO's director of HIV/AIDS? (/juvenile)
Give it a minute... some conspiracy theorists with think of a spin for this
ReplyDeletewith=will
ReplyDeleteDidn't you know that any study showing benefits of circ is biased and flawed, any doctor supporting it is a quack, etc.
ReplyDeleteWhy do we care if circumcision is a net benefit or a net neutral for health? We don't do it for health reasons, we do it for religious/cultural reasons, and we'd do it anyway.
ReplyDeleteI feel like this is an advertisement trying to convince me that the car I just bought is a great car. I already bought it!
And if it showed that it doubled the risk, what would you do then? The study is irrelevant from our POV.
ReplyDeleteLOL, you guys are way off. I just thought the healine ITSELF was funny and obviously written that way on purpose.
ReplyDeletehealine=headline
ReplyDeleteI agree that studies showing health benefits of other scientific "proofs" of halachic practices may irrelevant to those of us that would keep them anyway. They also have a downside in that if the alleged proof is debunked, those who relied on it to support their acceptance of halacha will be disillusioned. This is my key objection to the "bible codes" shenanigans.
ReplyDeleteHowever, in this case there is a significant upside to this study, in that it helps combat the hateful disinformation spread by the anti-circumcision groups, who have actually been campaigning to make it illegal. Anything that debunks those religion-hating kooks is a good thing. Maybe there are even secular Jews who are on the fence on this issue, who will now go decide in favor of circumcision, albeit for a "lo lishma" reason.
Using a condom is much more effective and less invasive.
ReplyDeleteHyrax: Oh, because of the use of "cut"?
ReplyDeleteElie: It's a good point that scientific findings like this or on, say, kosher meat, can both convince people to stop following halakhah and bring in people as well. Still, it's good to know, isn't it? Like if there's a benefit that is actually applicable to us, we say cool, and maybe understand something about ourselves more, and if something that might be detrimental, then it is good to know, and might mean we come up with new technologies so as to keep halakhah while mitigating the detriments. Also, I understand there are many folks who are not as extreme anti-routine-circumcision activists, who want to get rid of the pressure placed by the medical establishment to circumcise and want to have it accepted as not abnormal, but who understand and do not fight against the bris. Just as this finding really shouldn't change what we do, should we have an opinion on what others do? Do we anyway?
(juvenile) Did anyone catch the very fitting name of WHO's director of HIV/AIDS? (/juvenile)
Using a condom is much more effective and less invasive.
ReplyDeletemore effective, OK. but i had thought the whole point of using the condom was to be invasive...